Drowning in your to-do list? Feeling disconnected from your kids? New York Times best selling author Julie Morgenstern and host Amelia Phillips discuss the ultimate time management guide for parents. Plus instant hacks to connect more deeply with our kids and bring our stress levels down.
Below is an unedited transcript of the podcast episode:
I recently finished up a massive five month work project. To say that I’ve been out of balance is an understatement. I’ve been spending the least amount of time with my kids in their entire existence, sometimes not even seeing them in the morning at all, and maybe only 30 minutes at night before bed.
On the weekends. I’ve just been so exhausted and I haven’t had the patience to sit down and play in their world and really connect with. Meanwhile, the undercurrent of guilt and feelings of being overwhelmed have been flowing thick and really dragging me. The turning point recently was when I walked in the door one night and my two year old Ella, she just blanked me.
She literally looked at me like I was a stranger and I just recognized that things needed to change. I tracked down the perfect book to help me and fast forward to now, I’m proud to say that our entire family life has had a dramatic shift.
This is healthy her with Amelia Phillips and. Going to learn how to organize our life in a way that brings out the best in our children and ourselves. In my quest to regain control and balance, I was recommended the book Time to Parent by New York Times bestselling author, Julie Morganton. I followed her blueprint to get out of my recent overwhelming state, and it has literally changed the dynamic in my family.
I tracked Julie down in New York and am so pleased that we’ve been able to juggle time differences and schedule. Talk today. Julie, thank you so much for joining me today on Healthy Her. It’s great to be here with you, Amelia. I’m looking forward to the conversation now. You’ve published two New York Times best sellers around time management and organizing, and you’ve appeared on the Oprah Win Free show, which is amazing.
But tell me, Julie, how challenging was it to shift into time management for parents specifically? You know, in one way it wasn’t difficult at all because with several decades of organizing and time management, uh, which I’d been doing, uh, this business for quite a while, um, so many of our clients happened to be parents because, The parenting years are the most time stretched years of any human’s life.
There is no more demanding period of time. What was a little bit challenging was I didn’t feel prepared. To advise parents on how to divide their time until I understood first what the scientists said children need from their parents. Because though I was an organizing and time management expert, and I can design systems left, right, sideways, upside down, inside, out, outside in any configuration, I, I really did not feel it was responsible for me to say, Here’s how you should balance your time, until I knew what kids really need from parents and caretakers to feel loved and secure.
So I actually embarked on research. And I dove into the science of human development, interviewing experts in every single science and doing focus groups and reading thousands of pages of studies. And then I was able to finally like get the answers and synthesize in language and through the lens of what a parent really cares about, which is how much time and attention does my kid need from me?
To feel loved and secure. That was the unique work that I had to do to, to pivot into just time management, just for parents. Through your research, you’ve been able to divide the roles of parents into two main categories, which we’ll talk about soon, but as a management coach, you took the role of parenting and you applied the same job description framework that you do in manage.
To parenting. Why did you feel that it was important to do this as a time management expert and coach for many decades? Well, not many decades, but at least a couple . One thing I discovered was regardless of the position, regardless of the industry, regardless of the role, when your job description isn’t, That is a recipe for overwork, inefficiency, and insecurity.
If you don’t know what your job is in any role, how do you know when your day is done? How do you know where your strengths lie and where you need development? And I knew that from a, as a time management coach, many times I go into companies to do time management coaching, and when people don’t know what their actual job, They are burning it at both ends and they can’t make traction cuz they don’t.
It’s ambiguous. So I thought what parents need is a job description. They need, what are the roles, what? Give me the roadmap and then I can figure out what is it that I’m supposed to juggle my time between, and then I can assess how I’m doing, where I’m naturally strong. Where I have no idea what I’m doing and I might need some help.
And you can monitor yourself. So I was like, that is who doesn’t want a manual. Right? Oh, absolutely. And you had this beautiful quote in your book, you said, Understanding these roles and responsibilities leads to wrapping our arms around the job of being a parent. And it’s so funny, I really resonated with that line because.
In doing my podcast research and interviewing, I get to speak to lots of experts and when I feel like an expert has given me some golden nuggets of parenting advice, I wrap my arms around that advice and I go home and I’m like, I’ve got this. And I, and I work at it with my children, and it’s such a mindset.
From that feeling of insecurity or not sure about what you’re doing to, I’ve got this and, and that’s what I, I love about that idea of, you know, having those roles and responsibilities so you know what you’re doing. You’re feeling confident about it. Yeah, Clarity. Clarity is the first step. Well, talking of clarity, you have these two main categories that you divide our parenting workload into, and there are two acronyms, one’s part and one’s self.
Can you talk us through these? So first to raise a happy, healthy human, we have to do our part, P A R t four activities that we have to juggle our time between. To do our part for our kids. P stands for provide. We have to spend time working to make money and manage money to pay for all the things that kids need.
It’s a big part of the job. Yeah. Put a roof over their head, provide clothes, put food on the table, clothes on their back, et cetera. Exactly right, and that’s, that’s the first thing we have to spend. That’s one thing we have to spend time on. Then a stands for a range. Raising a happy, healthy human requires arranging an enormous amount of logistics for kids.
Where are they going to school? How are they gonna get there? What are we eating for breakfast, lunch, and dinner? Who’s doing the shopping? Who’s doing the cleaning? All of those things and all of that. Far more time than anybody ever realizes. Even when you do it, you’re like, Holy Molly, this is, It’s endless.
I needed an MBA yesterday just to sign my child up to little athletics. Yeah. Oh my goodness. It took me 45 minutes to sign one child up to a, a silly sport . Right? So those logistics can eat you alive, they can eat you whole. Right. But it’s a necessary component. That we spend time on. That’s the a r is for relate.
We have to spend time relating to our kids getting to know them for the unique individuals they are. That even, you know, you mentioned in your intro about like how you’re so involved in provide doing some huge work project and I bet you continue to do the arranging, but your kid looked at you like a stranger after two weeks cuz you weren’t getting to spend any of the relate.
Right. So it’s essential. And, and you felt it and she felt it. And then the, the fourth activity for raising a happy, healthy human is teach tea. For teach parents’. Job is to teach values and life skills to help our kids be successful as adults for activities, provide a range, relate, and teach. Doing your part for another human.
Nothing else you have to do for your kids. Everything you have to do for your kids falls in one of those four quadrants in your parenting matrix of doing your part, you also talk about the invisible and the visible and the adult world and the child world. Can you explain these? So for listeners, cuz I know this is a podcast, so we don’t have a visual.
I want you to just picture. Like a little grid, a four, like two by two. You know, it’s like a little square with quadrants. And we think as parents, normally that time spent on any one of the four activities counts as all time in. So our parenting time, whether we’re spending it on providing or relating, or teaching or arranging, it just all counts as one to us.
But to kids, they feel very different. And if you’ve ever. Pondered the mystery of that phenomenon where you have parents who say, You know, I sacrificed my whole life for my kids, and those kids say my parents were never there for me. That happens so often. Why is that? It happens because some of the activities that we have to spend our time on are visible to our kids and some are invisible.
Some take place in the adult world, some take place in the kids world. So think about provide. Provide takes place in the adult world and the time we spend working is largely invisible to our kids. A range takes place in the kids’ world because there’s either lunch and dinner and clean clothes and a roof over their head or not.
So they feel the effects of it, but the time it takes us to do that is largely invisible to our kids. They don’t see how much time it takes to sign them up for things. You’re doing it during the workday, while they’re sleeping, while they’re napping, while they’re at school, they don’t see it. Relate and teach are the two activities that are visible to our kids.
They see us relating, they see us teaching, but even they are more different than we realize. So think of it this way. When we teach our kids, we are bringing kids into the adult world and they are the students of us. When you relate to a child, you actually enter the child’s world and you are the student of the child.
Oh, I think that’s really powerful when you think about that, even teaching when you feel like, Oh, I’m bonding, I’m, you know, teaching this child and we are doing it together, you’re actually dragging them into the adult world where they are still the student. They are having to learn from you. And is that why in the relate world where you are coming into the child’s world, that’s the most important quadrant for affirmation and recognition of their self worth?
Exactly. That is exactly right. And it’s an oddly, it’s the hardest thing for parents to do. Oh, I’m so glad you said that. Are there any moms out there that like sitting and playing blocks with their kids? Because I really wanna love it. I really want to, but I just don’t, I wanna shoot myself. You wanna play the game again?
You wanna tell me the story like for the 42nd time? First of all, just take this as a human yourself. Isn’t it true? That when you feel the most validated and the most valued and the most important, it’s when someone is listening to you is entering your world, not trying to teach you anything. How often when you are struggling with something or you’re wanna share something exciting, do you want someone to say, Oh, you know what you should do to fix that?
Let me teach you so, No, you just want to be heard and known. So here’s my advice to parents. This is like a game changer. And I got this, This was where I went deep on that research. I was like, Tell me how to do this. Cause it was really hard for parents. How do you enter your child’s world? So there’s a couple things to make sure you’re entering the child’s world.
You’re not pulling them into yours. First of all, get on eye level, whatever their height is, you need to get eyeball to eyeball. Get down on the floor or stoop down, or be on a chair and have them up on a little whatever, their high chair, their co, whatever, If what they wanna do is so boring to you that you like wanna kill yourself instead of focusing on your enjoyment.
Of that activity or that story, what they wanna talk about or what they wanna do. Do not focus on your enjoyment of it. You’re there as an observer to look at that activity or story through your child’s eyes and observe without judgment. What is it about this game that excites them or challenges them or makes them laugh?
What is it about this story? So you’re just there as a student of the child. The activity is the medium with which you get to study and look at the world through their eyes. Why do they keep wanna playing this? Is it because they’re so determined and they have so much grit, they’re gonna keep doing this until they mastered it?
Is the story. They keep wanting to repeat the story. Like what is it about the story that engages them? Is it that it’s a story of like an animal and they’re just like in love with animals and they’re just like, you know, is it a fantasy? Like what is it that engages them? And if you do that, it’s interesting because you are a student of that child.
Not a participant who’s loving to play blocks. Oh, that is such a game changer. That is a paradigm shift. It’s not about your enjoyment. No. What is it about them and this activity that is just getting them so intrigued, Of course, and, and you love your child to pieces you’re going to wander understand, and I’m sure it would be a fascinating insight into the workings of their personality as well.
Yeah, and then you learn things that you can then use to help and teach them and guide them later, like when they’re frustrated with their schoolwork, you can be like, You know, I watched you do that skateboard trick 82 times until you mastered it. You’ve got the determination that you can apply to this math, algebra.
If it’s a teenager, you know, and I’ll tell you something, it was so helpful to me cuz when I was raising my daughter, I, I didn’t even write, start writing the book until she had gone off to college because I, you can’t, who has time to do this research when they’re in the middle of raising them? You’re just trying to get through the day.
But this was something I wish I had known. Because I felt as a single parent, two things. One, I felt so guilty working all the time that I felt from the time I got home from work until I put her to bed and every minute of every weekend, I needed to be fully present for her. Because I was making up for lost time.
And then what she wanted to spend time on, like, I mean, like I hated going to amusement parks and I, I would just like, ugh, I would do it had I known, all I had to do was like, stop trying to enjoy the activity and study my kid. I would’ve been, I would’ve shown up with all four pause. But the great thing about what you’re teaching is I.
It hasn’t impact at any age. Even if mom’s listening now have teenagers or young adults or even grandkids that are coming through the mix, like you could start these at any age you can, and I, I’m glad that you brought that up because I speak about this a lot and it’s probably the number one question that comes up from audiences is like, is it too late?
Like my kid is six or eight or 12 or 15 or 22, and it’s never, ever too late. And I’ve seen evidence of it over and over because isn’t this the game changer, right? Because once we get this right, then there’s time for work and there’s time for a range and all that kind of stuff. Like this is the baseline.
I really wanna talk to you about this particular part in your book that literally did transform my parenting. It’s the rhythm of staying present with your child. Talk me through this discovery around the most important time to be truly present with your child. So the key is when it comes to that presence, it’s very important to recognize.
That it doesn’t have to be for big blocks of time. The result of those eight years of research, the answer to the mysterious, hard to get the answer question was that what children thrive on and what makes them feel loved and feel secure and like they’re important and valued in the world and they’re loved by you, is short bursts of truly undivided attention regularly.
Not big blocks of time delivered occasionally, so short bursts. Why? Because kids have short attention spans and many experts I read and talked to, they said, calculate about a minute. For each age of life, of attention span for this like real one-on-one stuff, one minute for a one year old, five minutes for a five year old, 10 minutes for.
15 minutes for 15 year old if you’re lucky. . Right? . So, and that makes a lot of sense. If you stop and just digest that, it’s like, Yeah. And we’re talking about that. Like I am here eyeball to eyeball. In your world, you’re the most important thing. Everything else disappears. Short bursts what is delivered regularly mean.
It means built into the fabric and the rhythm of the day, not I’m organizing a big quality time experience for the weekend and yeah, a guilt ridden trip to the zoo because I haven’t been spending enough time with you that always ends in a meltdown before you’ve left the house, cuz you won’t let them wear their dress up high heels to the zoo ruined your one quality makeup moment.
It’s like, Hey kid. Wait a minute. This was supposed to make them for the week . But it’s, it’s not that, That’s not what does it, what what does it is it’s built into the fabric of the day. So if you think about the five key transition points in a kid’s day, there’s, when they first wake up, there’s, when you sort of part in the morning, you go off to work, they go off to school.
Even if it’s in the same house now, still there’s a little separation. There’s coming back together after work and after school or daycare, there’s dinner. And bedtime. Those are the five key transition points if you make those, the first moments of every one of those is the undivided attention. That is the re.
They just know I can count when I see my mom, when I see my dad. The first thing is they are happy to see me and they’re gonna enter my world, and then we can do it together. But a part-time, it’s actually so simple and that’s why it’s a game changer, because you can do this, you can adopt this into your life, and it’s that idea, and this is what happened.
What I noticed when I started doing this was, My rhythm was that I would dread walking in the door because I was so overwhelmed from my day at work that I would open the door and they would come running over to me and I would just energetically push them away because I’ve gotta go to the bathroom.
I’ve gotta go and speak to my husband. I’ve gotta get dinner on the table and all the, you know, provide and arranging stuff. But once all stemmed, then I will do that quality time with you. And when I realized that it. Initial connection and also when I realized the short time span. So if you’ve got a one year old, it’s one minute before they get distracted.
Five year old five minutes. The pressure for me to spend that quality time dissipated because it was short bursts, and so I did what you suggested and literally would drop my bags on the floor, get down on their level, and I saw it. They cuddle and they knock me over with the cuddles, and then a few minutes later they’re off.
And then I can go and prepare the dinner uninterrupted or speak to my husband. It is game changing. It’s a game changer and so counterintuitive, but it really, really works and it makes so much sense. It also changes marriages. When you see your spouse, at the end of the day, the first thing should be, how was your day Enter their world too.
Not you should hear about the day that I had. No. First moments are what count and it’s short, and then you have all the freedom that you need. Okay. We’ve spent a lot of time talking on doing your part, which is about raising a human, but there’s another part to the job description of being a parent, and that is being a human.
Talk me through the self acronym. Okay, So we have the four things you have to do to raise a happy, healthy human, P a R t. You also need to be a happy, healthy human. So there’s four activities. That allow us to be happy, healthy humans, and they spell the acronym self as in fueling yourself, s E l F. So we have to spend time on sleep, rest to keep our brains working, our energy up, our patients up.
Try being patient, teaching or arranging or dealing with all this stuff. When you have only had four hours sleep, you’re not very good at it. So sleep. That’s SE is exercise. It’s, and it’s formal and informal. It’s movement, st fit, sting, energized, keep your energy up and your confidence, which you gotta feel good about yourself to keep showing up for all the problems you have to solve for your kids.
That’s a great way of thinking it. I love that. Your chief problem solver, like you need to feel like, okay, I got it in me. That’s the e l is for love, that we have to spend time on our adult love relationships. If you don’t nurture your adult love relationships, you have two things that steal from your kid.
One, you are not nurtured and it makes it harder to nurture your kids when you’re not getting your cup refilled. It’s all give and no refill. And two, when you don’t nurture your adult relationships, especially if you’re married, is then you start feeling very distracted. From your kids because you’re worried.
There’s tension. You feel out of alignment. There’s drifting. It’s the most common thing in the world. When I did all these interviews with couples, every couple was like, We know we should be spending more time together as a couple separate from our parenting, but A, with what time, And B, anytime we like have a date night.
We’re just sitting there staring at each other like, I don’t even know what to talk to you about anymore. Like you, it, it’s just the most common thing. So you have to like nourish that. To keep yourself whole, but also not distractedly to keep that going. And then the F in self is what I call fun. I define fun as the hobbies or passions or pure relaxation activities that when we do those, we feel.
Us your happy place. It’s your happy place. You feel like you, and you don’t even need a large dose of it, a small dose. And you’re like, I know who I am. I am me. And that also gives you the grounding and the confidence and the clarity to deal with everything else. So you can’t skip that. Either it’s essential and so self, That’s sleep, exercise, love, fun.
Parents are like, Are you kidding me? That sounds great. . Where’s the time gonna come from? Well, you’ll be pleased to know, Julie, that pretty much my entire. Podcast is dedicated to self. So for all the mums out there going not getting enough self, you can just scroll through and listen to any of our episodes and there’ll be something in there on sleep, exercise, love, and fun.
So I’m probably not gonna focus so much on that today because of the time that we have, and you’ve just got so many gold nuggets in your book that I wanna keep drilling down, if that’s okay, particularly in your category. Teach. So we’re back in the part, the P A R T for Teach. You go into detail about life skills and the life skills that we should be teaching our kids.
So you had organizing time management, money management, and mastering academic skills. Can you elaborate on each of these, and particularly through the age brackets where. Yeah, sure. So those, what you just said, like time management organizing, money management, and sort of academic support. Those are the four life skills that are not taught in school.
Very often it falls to parents to teach kids, and yet most parents weren’t taught those things either. But they really are the kind of infrastructure of life. When you get time management done, when you get organizing skills and money management skills, it’s what I call the oil in the machine of life, then you can achieve all your goals and without those, that oil, you have all the talent and all the skill and capability in the world, but you can’t find your keys or you lose your homework or you’re always running out of time and wasting time.
So in the book, I put in there a real age by age guide of how to teach kids organizing skills, age by age and time management, age by age, money and academics. I went to experts for to get those answers cuz they are. But time management, organizing. I knew how to do that. My super skill. So time management.
Let’s just talk about this. How do you teach that age by age? You know, you start by teaching time, consciousness. Right, that when you talk to little kids, toddlers, you start teaching them like, how long do you think it’s gonna take to clean up the toys? Ah, it’s gonna take an hour. It’s gonna take a half an hour.
Let’s set a timer and let’s see how long it takes. Oh my gosh. It takes five minutes. You actually show them, so you just te like you talk. When they’re younger and as they get a little bit older, I would say that from like middle school, for example. Yeah, So middle school for the Aussie moms out there is year seven and eight.
Middle school is where kids can start to make their own time map. And a time map is like a grid that it’s 168 hours in the week. That’s what we all have to work with. Seven days a week, 24 hours. And you say, Okay, block off the hours that you sleep. Okay, Block off the hours you’re in school. Okay? Block off if you have any other regular things that you have to go to black off time for dinner.
How much space is. What do you need to spend that time on homework? Which of those blocks are gonna do homework, extracurriculars, and hobbies? Where are those gonna go? What about your me? Where’s your social time? And it’s like a puzzle. And the kids become it. It’s visible. They time becomes visible. It’s a container.
It has to fit like six categories of stuff. And that is the, That is when you teach them that. What about for their sort of five to 10 year olds with time management, where they’ve learnt to tell the time and they’re becoming that little bit more independent. Is it the same principle? Similar, except I think it can be a little bit at that point, timing the.
So like with homework, how do you plan your homework? Well, time, how long it takes to do the average math problem. When you’re have reading class, how long time, how long it takes you to read a a page and then count how many pages the assignment is and then you can do the math and go, Oh, to read a chapter, it takes me 45 minutes.
So I have to read a chapter a night to get in time for whatever. So it’s like time, awareness of your own, how long things take you, and then what can I do to make that time less? I can be prepared when I come in. I can’t, you know, So it’s more personalized. I think just even being a mom, hearing you saying, It’s actually schools don’t teach this stuff.
It’s actually our responsibility in that teach category of teaching them to be organized, time management, money management, mastering their academic skills. And as you explain it, being, you know, the oil that helps their machine of life run better is again, that paradigm shift. Can I ask, say one thing for everybody listening about this, because I know how parents react, they’re like, but I don’t know those skills.
How am I supposed to teach my kid? And there’s enormous guilt. When you are a disorganized parent, you see your kid being disorganized, there’s so much guilt. It’s like you’re looking at your own failure in the face. So what I wanna say is that it is never too late to learn those skills and any of those life skills that you haven’t mastered.
Learn them alongside your. Just do it with them. Become time conscious together. Time yourselves together. Learn how to fill out a time map together. And that’s what I put in the book. Literally. This was like a roadmap you can learn right with your kid, every single one of these skills. And then it’s like a fun adventure together.
My husband went to boarding school and he is super organized and when we first moved in together he used to sing the song in a kind of condescending way to me, Millsy a place for everything and everything in its place. And it was amazing how that was a huge learning for me to, who used to just shove things in.
Available space possible. And I now find myself singing that to my kids. And when they bring some object home and I say a place for everything, everything in its place, where is its place going to be? Where’s its home? Uh, and, you know, you can, you can weave those little tips that you learn along the way and you’re learning on the job as well.
And it makes a big difference to both of us and to the kids. And it’s a gift to the kids. It’s not, you’re not harassing them. , you’re giving them a life skill that will serve them the rest of their lives. You should never feel guilty about doing that. You call family values, your ultimate time rudder. Can you explain this?
Yeah. I mean, look, discipline is kind of always a big issue for parents, how much time they have to spend disciplining their kids and not then having time to relate to their kids and all that stuff. But I think that when you define values, It helps you pick your battles and it helps you manage your time.
So when I was raising my daughter, I decided that there were really only two big rules. One is you can never do anything to hurt yourself and anything to hurt other people. That’s it. Everything else was fine, and that allowed me to be able to identify when I saw something, Is this worth a battle? Is this worth the time?
It just, it was like a huge time saver, right? It wasn’t like, Oh, do I spend time on this or that? It was like, I always knew when it was time to raise my hand and have a teaching moment. Some of the simple values that you put forward I think are really relevant to moms, and I know having sat down and thought about our family values before, it’s quite helpful to have some prompts and you had some values.
Always tell the truth even when tempted not. Work hard and try your best and never do anything to hurt yourself and other people, as you just mentioned. You know? And even if you just start with one or two simple ones, uh, I love this idea of it. It does become the rudder. It does make you help to choose your battles.
Oh, that was a family value that just got broken. Okay, I am going to seize this moment for a teaching opportunity. Exactly. For all the moms listening who cringe at the thought of a fully structured life, can you put our mind at ease that this organization and these job descriptions are not going to stifle our creativity, our spontaneity, and our intuitive parenting?
Yeah, for sure. So I really am a believer, and first of all, organized enough, we have to. Strike a balance between structure and spontaneity. We’re raising kids. Kids have so many things that are unpredictable, their moods, what happens to them, their developmental challenges, like there’s so much that’s unpredictable that if you just put in some basic structure like the five anchors in the day, it is far easier to deal with the spontaneous if you’re not making.
Spontaneous decisions about the predictable basic stuff. What time are we gonna wake up? Should be the same time every day. If you have to decide every day what time we go to bed and what time we go to sleep, you are not at all available for the spontaneous connections because you’re distracted with, do we go to bed at 10 or 11 tonight?
Do we have dinner at four or do we have dinner at six? So make the predictable, mundane stuff automatic and put structure around that. It’s your basic, like the skeleton infrastructure of your day. We wake up, we go to sleep. This is what we’re having to eat. We’re not gonna make it fancy. It’s like boom, boom, boom.
You have the same 10 meals, we rotate them every two weeks. , that’s the basics, are structured and it frees you to live life spontaneously. On top of that, enjoy the meal, have a great dinner conversation. Deal with the kid’s scuffed knee on the way to something, because I have time, because I’m not distracted with the stupid, everyday mundane things, I’m deciding every day what to do.
That’s the balance between structure and spontaneity. Finally, for a mom listening who is constantly feeling overwhelmed and like they aren’t doing anything particularly well, what is the first step she can take to feeling back in control of her life? Such a good question. I actually think that the first thing that I always recommend, any really overwhelmed mom, it’s counterintuitive again, but it’s to start with self and to pick two moments in the day of 20 minute doses or less.
And find one or two daily anchors of 20 minutes or less that are your time, and you organize everything else around that. And if it’s 10 minutes or 20 minutes of working out at home, taking a walk, or doing art for 10 minutes after dinner while the kids are doing something else, you have two self anchors in the day of 10 or 20 minutes or less.
You’re gonna start to feel in control. You’re gonna get back to who you are, and then you can start, okay, next with the kids. Your short burst and everything else falls into place. Don’t start with the work. Start with the nurturing first. You then your kids. Julie Morganson. Thank you so much. This is my pleasure.
It was a fun conversation.
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